Religion and tolerance

Haiku [from N.O.], points to the Robert Lindsay piece on Islam producing psychopaths. [This post appears only at OoL.]

Though it’s difficult to disagree with Lindsay, I’d like to digress and look at two other aspects – his quote below and then religion in general.

When it comes to anger, Western societies widely agree that it is a sign of weakness. Uncontrolled explosions of this unpleasant feeling are maybe the fastest way of losing face, especially in Northern countries, and though angry people may be feared, they are never respected.

In Muslim culture, anger is much more accepted, and being able to intimidate people is seen as strength and source of social status. We even see ethnic Muslim groups or countries proudly declare whole days of anger, and use expressions such as “holy anger” — a term that seems contradictory in peaceful cultures.

In Western societies, the ability to handle criticism constructively if it is justified, and with a shrug if it is misguided, is seen as an expression of self-confidence and authenticity.

Many fellow bloggers plus myself do the anger bit in print because things are so frustrating with LibLabCon, the EU, Obama and all the rest of it. Julia gets stuck in, most of us do. Seems to me that the reader prefers to believe a calm article, supported by facts, though perhaps sympathizing with the ranter.

However, a lot of shill-ing and trolling is done by those coming over as erudite, calm and collected, using simple fonts and well laid out pages. Compare that to the lurid colour on black, heavily capitalized and shrill, going left field to the point most would click out – pity because there are often morsels in there worth pursuing elsewhere.

Onto religion.

This might sound strange coming from me, the OoL author who fights for the Judaeo-Christian antecedents of our society but no society should be a theocracy, least of all the Christian – that’s just open to abuse and has been throughout history. And if that is so for a benign religion – look at the NT text, not the zealous followers – then it is how many thousand times more so for Islam?

This so-called religion has to be one of the greatest blights on the world, particularly for women but also for men – hands chopped off, weekly beheadings in Riyadh and so on. Call me extreme but methinks that any non-indigenous addition to these islands must be asked if he/she embraces UK law as overriding other law. If not, then out.

Turning that back on Christians who cannot accept gay “marriage” ever – and look at the recent Louisiana ruling against it – are they to leave if they can’t accept that law?

Answer is no if they are from here and of British stock. If this is their original home, then they are entitled to not accept it, just as pagans are within their rights not to accept the state telling people they must go to church on Sundays.

Because there’s another tradition in these islands, is there not? The tradition of being free to pursue one’s own path.

But to impose that freedom on the society – is that not coercive? Can a Muslim argue that for us to impose values of freedom and tolerance is just as extreme as they are?

Somewhere along the way, someone has to say stop – that sort of thing is just sophistry. Those are the values of our islands and you’re wishing to impose the opposite. No thanks, goodbye – there’s the aeroplane.

13 comments for “Religion and tolerance

  1. Viscount Rectum
    September 7, 2014 at 12:44 pm

    If I go into a wood and sit down put a bucket over my head and stay there for twentyfour hours , I may escape from hearing or seeing a muslim or reading about or watching the bloodbath that is Islam,

  2. Voice of Reason
    September 8, 2014 at 12:44 am

    There is no doubt that extreme Islam is a very destructive movement, and will ultimately bring down its own end. The real question is how we protect against it without becoming just as destructive ourselves? Look at the history of the Crusades, where each side became ever more barbaric.

    • Viscount Rectum
      September 8, 2014 at 6:54 am

      Could religion be part of Darwinian theory of survival of the fittest (or the most intelligent),are we little different from pond life in the survival stakes?

    • James Strong
      September 8, 2014 at 7:48 am

      No. There is plenty of doubt that ‘extreme Islam…will ultimately bring down its own end.’
      It will bring about the end of Western European culture in this country and others unless it is opposed.
      The sooner it is confronted the better. But I fear that it will have to be done with extreme violence.
      I do not look forward to this, but I do not see an effective alternative.
      My policy would be to go international. Say ‘you are worshipping a false god. If there is another attack on Western interests in the name of Islam then we will annihilate its ‘holiest’ places.’

      I’d love to be in the Oval Office.

      • Voice of Reason
        September 8, 2014 at 1:54 pm

        They will destroy themselves, especially if they succeed. If nothing else, modern technology will be gone, and most will starve.

    • Lord T
      September 12, 2014 at 1:21 pm

      It has survived in some of the most inhospitable areas on the planet for centuries. They don’t need technology or western values. If fact, our values and tools just help them grow and when they eradicate us they will go back to be goat herders etc.

      It won’t die out on it’s own. It will need to be exterminated with extreme prejudice. Crusades II.

  3. Furor Teutonicus
    September 8, 2014 at 8:56 am

    XX When it comes to anger, Western societies widely agree that it is a sign of weakness. Uncontrolled explosions of this unpleasant feeling are maybe the fastest way of losing face, especially in Northern countries,XX

    “Especially in Northern countries?”

    The place were Beserkers were INVENTED!?!?

  4. Furor Teutonicus
    September 8, 2014 at 8:58 am

    XX Call me extreme but methinks that any non-indigenous addition to these islands must be asked if he/she embraces UK law as overriding other law. If not, then out.XX

    That would remove most of the Catholics then. Where Papal law comes above the law of the land in which they live.

    • meltemian
      September 10, 2014 at 1:02 pm

      In what way does Papal law come above the law of the land?

      I hesitate to point out that the Catholics were here before the Anglicans.

  5. Roue le Jour
    September 8, 2014 at 11:32 am

    There are a number of counties with minority Muslim populations outside the west, my home of Thailand being one of them. The way to deal with them seems to be one of Zero Tolerance, i.e. nip that ‘Behead those who oppose Islam’ stuff in the bud. Toleration only encourages them.

    So, too late now, obviously.

  6. subwus
    September 10, 2014 at 8:50 pm

    Have had it with Islam.
    I won’t go into the details, but enough to say that at one point in my younger years, I toyed with the idea of converting to the RoP to bring some self discipline and order into the turmoil of my life.
    Fortunately I never did convert.
    I stumbled upon something called ‘personal responsibility’ instead, though this was years before I ever knew of ‘libertarianism’.
    I think that after fifty years or so of the multicultural experiment (whether you believe in that kind of thing or not), one religion now stands out as a sore thumb, it is certainly not those who are Hindu or Sikhs.
    I have to say, it is a crying shame for those Muslims who just want to bumble along with their lives and who are not inclined to convert the West to Islam, but the pathologies of Islam have introduced enough trouble to selectively justify that the door be slammed shut on any further introduction of that religion.

    • Lord T
      September 12, 2014 at 1:24 pm

      I don’t think there are any Muslims that would just bumble along with life. They do because they have no choice but when they start getting control even those supposed moderates will be out with their machetes.

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